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BooksandTrees
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On 11/2/2020 at 12:05 PM, BooksandTrees said:

I'm wondering if I'll fall into that scenario, but I know they don't really scale this exam so we will see. I don't want to build up hope and have it crushed. I've accepted I am retaking it.

okay, yes. This exam is a different story if it is not scaling with respect to other participants. I hope you get it done this time. and if not, I am sure you can use the experience to nail it the next time.

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9 hours ago, BooksandTrees said:

I don't like my taste in women.

what do you mean? I know finding a partner is hard but the harder part is to get along well with her/him for the long time. 

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39 minutes ago, Mohammad said:

what do you mean? I know finding a partner is hard but the harder part is to get along well with her/him for the long time. 

I find that I'm attracted to very emotionally needy women. Like ones that need to constantly say you love them and are very fragile. It's like I want to care for them more than the average woman and I think it has to do with me being emotionally neglected as a child. I think by me caring for someone it's somehow giving my mind the impression I'm giving love to myself. I don't like it because I think it's going to lead me to being manipulated by emotionally controlling women. 

In my past, I've dated women who reward me heavily for being ultra affectionate, but if I let off the gas pedal and don't say "I love you" all of the time or am super affectionate then they notice and instead of asking what's wrong with me they will pick a fight so I act emotional again.

I think it's also because I want to be told I'm loved and I think if I give this woman a ton of affection she'll in turn give me a ton of affection. Which is never the case.

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3 hours ago, BooksandTrees said:

I find that I'm attracted to very emotionally needy women. Like ones that need to constantly say you love them and are very fragile. It's like I want to care for them more than the average woman and I think it has to do with me being emotionally neglected as a child. I think by me caring for someone it's somehow giving my mind the impression I'm giving love to myself. I don't like it because I think it's going to lead me to being manipulated by emotionally controlling women. 

In my past, I've dated women who reward me heavily for being ultra affectionate, but if I let off the gas pedal and don't say "I love you" all of the time or am super affectionate then they notice and instead of asking what's wrong with me they will pick a fight so I act emotional again.

I think it's also because I want to be told I'm loved and I think if I give this woman a ton of affection she'll in turn give me a ton of affection. Which is never the case.

I see what you mean. That is quite complex. I am happy to see the way you are analyzing your own behavior. I think when you know the root of the problem, you are half way there to find a solution. As you said, it is probably related to your childhood. Research has shown that talking about bad experience help people to relief the negative effects. I am all hear if you like to explain why you think you were neglected? I sometimes feel the same because my parents and family were attracted to my older brother. Hopefully, that never has had any bad lasting effect on me.

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2 hours ago, Mohammad said:

I see what you mean. That is quite complex. I am happy to see the way you are analyzing your own behavior. I think when you know the root of the problem, you are half way there to find a solution. As you said, it is probably related to your childhood. Research has shown that talking about bad experience help people to relief the negative effects. I am all hear if you like to explain why you think you were neglected? I sometimes feel the same because my parents and family were attracted to my older brother. Hopefully, that never has had any bad lasting effect on me.

I mentioned in several dozen pages ago but I know exactly why they did it so I'm ok with it. Thank you.

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4 hours ago, BooksandTrees said:

I mentioned in several dozen pages ago but I know exactly why they did it so I'm ok with it. Thank you.

how can I find it? Do you know the page or date of those writings? I am interested to know if you do not mind.

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On 10/23/2020 at 7:05 PM, BooksandTrees said:

I took the test. The first half went really well but the second half was extremely difficult and I don't think I did well. To be honest, I think I didn't pass the test. So we will see. They asked some absurd questions and I wasn't a fan of it.

When will you receive your results? I really hope you passed. You are very intelligent and put forth all the effort. 
 

Please let us know. 

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4 hours ago, Icandothis said:

When will you receive your results? I really hope you passed. You are very intelligent and put forth all the effort. 
 

Please let us know. 

Probably the first or second week of December. I hope I passed as well, but I am a realist and don't believe I did. That being said, several hundred people have said the same thing and I haven't met anyone who feels like they passed. I'll let you know. Don't expect anything lol.

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I don't like how I'm desperate for women's attention. It is making me very angry. I sacrifice my needs, responsibilities, thoughts, tasks etc for the chance to talk to a woman I'm interested in. 

This makes me feel weak and insecure. Bit above all else, it shows I don't respect myself or put myself first. 

I'm going to be sternly working on this over the next few months because I think it will also improve my porn addiction. I've watched a lot less over the years, but I think you should chase your dreams not for someone else. Why live for someone else? I'm not feeling it.

But to conclude with another point, I'm being too hard on myself by not forgiving myself for being manipulated by women in the past. I get angry and call myself pathetic but that solves nothing. It's time to use logic. Men are not emotional thinkers. Use logic. 

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6 hours ago, BooksandTrees said:

I don't like how I'm desperate for women's attention. It is making me very angry. I sacrifice my needs, responsibilities, thoughts, tasks etc for the chance to talk to a woman I'm interested in. 

This makes me feel weak and insecure. Bit above all else, it shows I don't respect myself or put myself first. 

I'm going to be sternly working on this over the next few months because I think it will also improve my porn addiction. I've watched a lot less over the years, but I think you should chase your dreams not for someone else. Why live for someone else? I'm not feeling it.

But to conclude with another point, I'm being too hard on myself by not forgiving myself for being manipulated by women in the past. I get angry and call myself pathetic but that solves nothing. It's time to use logic. Men are not emotional thinkers. Use logic. 

It's your life and your goals and your progress.

I think it's helpful to set standards for women to set your mind straight. I think a lot of women can give me a feeling of intimacy, emotional connection, attention, sex etc. Since there is a lot of women, the solution is that I need to be discriminating, because I don't have time to possibly give my attention to every such woman.

For example, I don't want a woman that has a boyfriend, smokes or watches TV/YT/films all the time. I do want a woman that keeps in shape, wants to meet me regularly and plans/wants to stay in my area for the near future.

Obviously, there are grey areas. Maybe we click in all other 10 areas, but she's an Erasmus foreigner and she'll leave in three months. For some people it's worth it to get into a relationship, for some it's not and some would make it into an open relationship. It's up to us to decide what is "worth" it.

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8 hours ago, BooksandTrees said:

I don't like how I'm desperate for women's attention. It is making me very angry. I sacrifice my needs, responsibilities, thoughts, tasks etc for the chance to talk to a woman I'm interested in. 

This makes me feel weak and insecure. Bit above all else, it shows I don't respect myself or put myself first. 

I'm going to be sternly working on this over the next few months because I think it will also improve my porn addiction. I've watched a lot less over the years, but I think you should chase your dreams not for someone else. Why live for someone else? I'm not feeling it.

I used to be very much the same way. I'm still the same way but not "very much", haha. I recognized that a lot of it had to do with how I was raised to be such a "mama's boy" because I had a weak father and an overbearing, narcissistic mother who made me rely on her for everything. Living with her while going through sobriety really helped to change my whole outlook on her and on women because I became super aware of how stupid and unnecessary everything she said to me was. I'm sure most of us have someone like this in our lives even if it isn't a parent... someone who is always giving advice that we didn't ask for and it often being bad advice. So, through that it helped me to realign my thoughts and feelings about my mother and in turn made me less eager to impress or emotionally satisfy every woman I encountered as if it was solely my responsibility to make them happy.

It's still an ongoing process for me as I've only been sober for 2 years. I'm not yet at a healthy point with women and, unfortunately due to my age, I might never be. But I went from constantly trying to impress every attractive (physically, not at all mentally) woman I met and trying to get approval from them to being pretty much indifferent and just seeing the more attractive women as sex objects instead of Venusian idols. Still not a great attitude to have toward an entire gender of people but it's moving in a direction in which I believe one day I'll actually see women as human beings instead of either objects or goddesses.

Quote

But to conclude with another point, I'm being too hard on myself by not forgiving myself for being manipulated by women in the past. I get angry and call myself pathetic but that solves nothing. It's time to use logic. Men are not emotional thinkers. Use logic. 

I had the same feelings for a long time as well so I understand where you're coming from. We're all emotional thinkers though, it's a mistake to think that men are more logical and thus are able to achieve some sort of objective perspective more easily. We appear more logical because we care about things more and women care about people more. Things generally require more logic to understand than people do. When it comes to our reactions, though, we're operating on emotion 100% of the time. Critical thinking is a skill, not a mindset. It's an over-used term that is mainly lauded by people who don't even know how to do it. I thought I did for years before taking a class on it in college and realizing how stupid I was (in a good way). It's exhausting and you can really only apply critical thinking for a few hours a day on a great day.

What helped me overcome this was to realize that I wasn't really manipulated by women. They often didn't ask me to do any of the things I did. I was using a weak and creepy model of how to gain a woman's favor which was "bestowed" upon me by my mother. Give them presents, tell them they're amazing every 5 minutes, blah blah blah. It's ridiculous. Never listen to what women say they want. Nobody really knows what they want. Look at what men who are successful with women do and try to extract something from that. Something better than the "assholes get all the girls" mindset which I also held for many years and isn't worth a damn lol.

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On 11/6/2020 at 9:09 AM, Ikar said:

It's your life and your goals and your progress.

I think it's helpful to set standards for women to set your mind straight. I think a lot of women can give me a feeling of intimacy, emotional connection, attention, sex etc. Since there is a lot of women, the solution is that I need to be discriminating, because I don't have time to possibly give my attention to every such woman.

For example, I don't want a woman that has a boyfriend, smokes or watches TV/YT/films all the time. I do want a woman that keeps in shape, wants to meet me regularly and plans/wants to stay in my area for the near future.

Obviously, there are grey areas. Maybe we click in all other 10 areas, but she's an Erasmus foreigner and she'll leave in three months. For some people it's worth it to get into a relationship, for some it's not and some would make it into an open relationship. It's up to us to decide what is "worth" it.

I agree. I just feel that there are times where I meet someone and develop feelings for them and i disregard all of the things I agree with you on and just put them first. I need to maintain that control and composure.

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I was in the same spot as @ceponatia - a narcissistic mom who ended up loving her sons more than her husband, because he was away all the time due to work in the military.

As for looking at women as objects; I think it's helpful to point out the correlation between looking good and being in a good shape mentally. I think it's good to think of that and switch the mindset from "I'm such a disgusting pig for looking at that woman's ass." to "Hey, her body shape looks nice, so she might be into working out or some other physical activity, as am I." Now I have a starter for the chat.

Putting work first is a good idea. It's always easier to find time to enjoy myself than to put in some work. And there won't only be good times with the woman either; there will be the hard and unpleasant talks as well.

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On 11/6/2020 at 9:38 AM, ceponatia said:

I used to be very much the same way. I'm still the same way but not "very much", haha. I recognized that a lot of it had to do with how I was raised to be such a "mama's boy" because I had a weak father and an overbearing, narcissistic mother who made me rely on her for everything. Living with her while going through sobriety really helped to change my whole outlook on her and on women because I became super aware of how stupid and unnecessary everything she said to me was. I'm sure most of us have someone like this in our lives even if it isn't a parent... someone who is always giving advice that we didn't ask for and it often being bad advice. So, through that it helped me to realign my thoughts and feelings about my mother and in turn made me less eager to impress or emotionally satisfy every woman I encountered as if it was solely my responsibility to make them happy.

It's still an ongoing process for me as I've only been sober for 2 years. I'm not yet at a healthy point with women and, unfortunately due to my age, I might never be. But I went from constantly trying to impress every attractive (physically, not at all mentally) woman I met and trying to get approval from them to being pretty much indifferent and just seeing the more attractive women as sex objects instead of Venusian idols. Still not a great attitude to have toward an entire gender of people but it's moving in a direction in which I believe one day I'll actually see women as human beings instead of either objects or goddesses.

I had the same feelings for a long time as well so I understand where you're coming from. We're all emotional thinkers though, it's a mistake to think that men are more logical and thus are able to achieve some sort of objective perspective more easily. We appear more logical because we care about things more and women care about people more. Things generally require more logic to understand than people do. When it comes to our reactions, though, we're operating on emotion 100% of the time. Critical thinking is a skill, not a mindset. It's an over-used term that is mainly lauded by people who don't even know how to do it. I thought I did for years before taking a class on it in college and realizing how stupid I was (in a good way). It's exhausting and you can really only apply critical thinking for a few hours a day on a great day.

What helped me overcome this was to realize that I wasn't really manipulated by women. They often didn't ask me to do any of the things I did. I was using a weak and creepy model of how to gain a woman's favor which was "bestowed" upon me by my mother. Give them presents, tell them they're amazing every 5 minutes, blah blah blah. It's ridiculous. Never listen to what women say they want. Nobody really knows what they want. Look at what men who are successful with women do and try to extract something from that. Something better than the "assholes get all the girls" mindset which I also held for many years and isn't worth a damn lol.

I feel your transformation. I think what we're going through is just such a long term awakening and path to a new direction that we need to be patient and observe how we change along the way. I've noticed a lot of changes and I just feel I continue to evolve into a better, less judgmental person. I hope your path keeps growing as well.

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Today I'm 106 weeks free from gaming and 108 weeks free from social media. I slept for 16 hours straight last night and feel better. I was just slammed with stress and burnout. I feel so great now. I took a long walk outside, got some food I enjoy, came back, and now relaxing before talking to friends.

I'm going to buy my drum set soon.

I'm also very happy for @Icandothis for beating cancer. We love you very much here and are so happy for you.

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I keep having anxiety problems or nightmares at night. The dreams aren't scary but they're all situational dreams that I can't control no matter my conversation and I wake up frustrated. 

I also said something stupid yesterday as a joke and I'm worried it will come back to bite me. I just wish I could keep my mouth shut sometimes because about once per year I do this and it crushes me.

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Books, Can you give some feedback about where this recent stress is coming from?

from your last two posts it looks like you don’t know the source. Are you still attending therapy? 

I am always doubting as to how much discussion of an issue can help in overcoming it. Sometimes it can have a counterproductive effect. I think this is determined by the type of person that is listening and advising you. I think on a number of occasions I frustrated you in the way that I approached the issue, hope it wasn’t too bad.

But over time you should develop skills in knowing how to discuss an issue that is concerning you in a delicate way. 

Edited by Amphibian220
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4 hours ago, Amphibian220 said:

Books, Can you give some feedback about where this recent stress is coming from?

from your last two posts it looks like you don’t know the source. Are you still attending therapy? 

I am always doubting as to how much discussion of an issue can help in overcoming it. Sometimes it can have a counterproductive effect. I think this is determined by the type of person that is listening and advising you. I think on a number of occasions I frustrated you in the way that I approached the issue, hope it wasn’t too bad.

But over time you should develop skills in knowing how to discuss an issue that is concerning you in a delicate way. 

I was frustrated because I've been mentally fatigued and too tired to work on my projects at work. I had a very productive day though and feel much better. I'm now thinking I'm gonna get my project done. I think it was just workplace performance stress and beating myself up.

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I find myself growing an unbelievable level of rage. It's so odd. I had a great day abs yesterday was also great. But I found myself discussing someone I don't like during therapy and now I find myself piercing with anger and wanting to smash something. 

I'm so frustrated. I think I never released any stress from studying, work, and life over the past month. I am frustrated with most of my friends. Fake and pathetic. Fuck them. 

These fucks don't give a shit about me. I got invited to 4 weddings next year. None of the brides or grooms to be text me, talk to me, or anything. It makes me sick. They don't understand friendship. 

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